Wichita police chief finalists discuss how they would handle the job (+videos)

For nearly three hours Monday night, Wichita police chief finalists Gordon Ramsay and Jeff Spivey took questions from the city manager and the public about how they would handle the top job in the largest law enforcement agency in the state.

Use of force and the department’s relations with the community – particularly regarding minorities and the mentally ill – were common themes.

The finalists appeared at a public forum in Century II Convention Hall.

Ramsay, 43, has been police chief in Duluth, Minn., for 10 years. Spivey, 48, has been an assistant police chief in Irving, Texas, for about five years.

City Manager Robert Layton expects to hire a chief this month.

What Ramsay said

To get better outcomes more often in responses to mental health calls, Ramsay said, his department has an embedded social worker. Across the nation, there is an over-reliance on police in dealing with mentally ill people, he said. It’s not fair to either police or those with mental health problems, he said.

Whatever the situation, “I believe that officers want to do the right thing.”

Still, “I think in any organization, there’s always room for improvement.”

Regarding the release of body camera video footage in shootings by officers, he said: “People want to see the video. I hear that.”

But he said the decision on whether to release the video should be up to legislators, not the police or the district attorney.

Ramsay noted that he has been in policing for 23 years, but still there is no reliable, less-than-lethal weapon. “I am a big supporter of less-than-lethal.”

An officer shouldn’t force a crisis when responding to a call, he said.

“It’s clear the public wants the police to talk more and use less force.”

Earlier, during a brief interview with media, Ramsay called for less focus on enforcement and more emphasis on building relationships between police and the community. He clarified: “You need some enforcement. … Community policing is not soft on crime.”

One woman in the audience said that police are guilty of both overpolicing, by coming in heavy-handed, and of underpolicing, by coming into neighborhoods and not interacting with residents.

On dealing with minorities, he said, “I want to make sure that everybody gets the same treatment.”

Police need support for the good things they do, but abuse of force should be dealt with swiftly and effectively, he said.

Regarding relationships with minorities, Ramsay told an NAACP official that he has worked closely with the NAACP in Duluth and that if he becomes chief in Wichita, “I assure you: I will be at your meetings.”

It’s not easy being a cop, Ramsay said. When one officer does something wrong, all the others in the department suffer.

“Don’t get me wrong; there’s work to be done.” Still, he said, it does no good to demoralize an entire department.

What Spivey said

In answer to a question about whether he would release body camera video footage in officer shootings, Spivey said he would as long as it didn’t interfere with the integrity of the investigation. Releasing the video offers transparency that is being demanded by the public, he added.

Police departments need to make sure they are recruiting and choosing the right people – because no amount of training will help if they hire they wrong people, he said.

How to de-escalate tense situations should be part of the training police receive on use of force.

Over the years, officers have gone to more of a “warrior mentality” when more of “guardian mentality” might be needed, Spivey said.

To prevent or address racial profiling, Spivey said, police need to have established relationships with community leaders. When there are widespread complaints, you need to look at the culture of the police department, he said. Officers need to get the community’s perspective.

“I expect every one of my police officers to treat everyone with respect, ” Spivey said.

Many encounters could end differently if officers allowed people to give their side, he said. An officer moving too quickly from call to call can shut down communication. The officer needs to be transparent by explaining why he is doing what he is doing in typical situations like traffic stops.

On human trafficking, he said, most of it involves prostitution at some level, which can often be dealt without by providing social services and job training.

On citizen review boards: Ultimately, the police chief needs to have final say on complaints taken up by review boards, because “I’m the one held accountable at the end of the day.”

Spivey said he would embrace a review board that is advisory.

How would he be an effective leader of the department when he is coming in as an outsider? It “doesn’t happen overnight,” Spivey said. There will be skepticism, distrust, a staff that is anxious about change and what it means for them.

Still, he said, by far, most cops have the best intentions and have a sincere desire to serve.

Spivey explained the benefit of “predictive policing”: systematically gathering data that can be used to predict where crime will occur. In a department that has around 40 vacancies, predictive policing allows managers to use staff more efficiently and be better stewards of tax dollars, Spivey said.

Police departments must constantly try to improve, Spivey said, or they become complacent, and then “your community is up in arms because you’re no longer meeting their … expectation of change.”

This story was originally published December 14, 2015 at 10:58 PM with the headline "Wichita police chief finalists discuss how they would handle the job (+videos)."